B"H
The Edah HaCharedit located in the Jerusalem Mea Shearim neighbourhood is famous for its anti - Zionism. The Edah is an umbrella organization for different chassidic groups such as Dushinsky, Toldot Aharon, Toldot Avraham Yitzchak, Satmar, Spinka and parts of Breslov. On the other hand, the Edah also includes litvishe groups such as Brisk. Additionally another group participates in the Edah HaCharedit. Those are the Mishkenot HaRoim, a rather secret group whose synagogue is located in Mea Shearim Street.
Whoever walks through Mea Shearim today should be careful judging the Chassidim. Not all inhabitants are anti - Zionist and you need detailed information about the history of each group in order to know who is who. If you don't know so don't judge.
One of the biggest mistakes people usually make is calling the Edah HaCharedit a Neturei Karta branch. In other words, the Edah is the Neturei Karta. The same prejudice hits the Satmarer Chassidim all the time. Although there are 100,000 Satmarer Chassidim worldwide, the group is hardly known in Europe. If you do not go to Monroe (Kiryat Yoel), Williamsburgh, Antwerp, London or Israel, you will hardly hear about them. Besides Antwerp and London, Europe is not interested in them. For people without further knowledge, Satmar and the Neturei Karta are one and the same thing. Although this is not true it cannot be denied that the Neturei Karta does have a certain influence on the Edah through Satmar.
What is the basis for the anti - Zionism of the Edah HaCharedit and Chassidut Satmar ?
The former Satmarer Rebbe, Rabbi Yoel Teitelbaum, turned Satmar into a big institution. Satmar (Satu Mare - Large Village) is located in today's Romania. In the past, it belonged to Hungary.
I am not explaining the whole Satmar history now, but I only want to mention briefly that Rebbe Yoel Teitelbaum was arrested by the Nazis and later was allowed to flee to Switzerland. In 1947, he moved to Israel for about one year and lived with his son - in - law before he moved to the States. Once he was in New York, he rebuilt the Chassidut Satmar. After his death in 1979, Satmar is a kind of split into different fractions and groups and has been undergoing many difficulties.
Rebbe Yoel Teitelbaum became really famous due to his extreme anti - Zionism. Rebbe Yoel, his Chassidim only called him "Rebbe Yoelish", did not found the anti - Zionist ideas. Already his father, Rabbi Chananyah Yom Tov Lippa and other famous rabbis had represented these ideas.
In 1958, Rebbe Yoel Teitelbaum's famous book "Vayoel Moshe" was published. What it says in the book, is the absolute law for the Edah HaCharedit. Until today. Rebbe Teitelbaum wrote about the anti - Zionist ideology since the foundation of the secular State of Israel. The Rebbe accuses the Zionists with harsh words and even attacks the religious Zionist movement.
In this article, I want to explain the most fundamental reasons against Zionism. These famous reasons are from Talmud Ketubot 111a and already the Vilna Gaon was referring to them. The Gemara in Ketubot 111a is describing a discussion between two rabbis but the discussion has its original source already in "Shir HaShirim".
Rebbe Teitelbaum mentioned further reasons in his book. The available literature on this subject seems to be endless. Chassidic as well as litvishe rabbis wrote plenty of books and articles and due to this reason, so far, I only want to mention the Talmudic reason from Masechet Ketubot.
The facts in Ketubot 110b - 111a, as I mentioned before, are from Shir HaShirim.
In the Babylonian diaspora right after the destruction of the First Temple, Rabbi Ze'ira asked Rabbi Yehudah if he is permitted to return to Eretz Israe. Rabbi Yehudah answered: Whoever ascends from Babylon to Eretz Israel transgresses a positive commandment. Only G - d decides about the end of the Babylonian Galut. Hence, He will give us a sign. It is absolutely forbidden to make up our own minds and rush back to Eretz Israel.
Rabbi Ze'ira claimed that this law only applies to the Temple Kelim (dishes for the Avodah) and not to the Jews. Rabbi Yehudah responds that immigration to Eretz Israel is prohibited and he quotes from Shir HaShirim 2:7:
"I have adjured you, O daughters of Jerusalem, by gazelles or by hinds of the fileds etc. should you wake or rouse the love until it pleases".
This teaches us metaphorically that we are bound by an oath not to ascend to Eretz Israel until the Final Redemption. Rabbi Ze'ira, however, interpreted the verse that the Jewish people should not converge upon Eretz Israel in a wall of force.
The "daughters of Jerusalem" are all Jewish generations. They received an oath from G - d not to rush the coming of the Meschiach before He makes the decision Himself. In case the Jews go up to Israel, it could arouse G - d's unconditional love for them and influence Him to the good. Thus, the Jews would force Him to bring the Meschiach.
Like "gazelles and hinds" means that if the Jews break their oath before the time, they could be hunted like gazelles and hinds.
Rabbi Yehudah presents the oath:
1. The Jewish people should not converge upon Eretz Israel in a wall of force.
2. The Jews should not rebel against the nations.
3. G - d told the idolaters not to subjugate the Jewish people more than sufficient.
You can find those three reasons three times in Shir HaShirim (2:7, 5:8 and 8:4).
The Gemara in Ketubot 111a lists another three additional oaths:
1. Jewish prophets should not reveal the exact time of the Ge'ulah.
2. The Jews should not distance the end through their sins.
3. The Jews should not reveal the secret to the idolaters.
In fact there are secret calculations on the Jewish calendar but they are not to be revealed.
It is possible to accelerate the coming of the Meschiach. Rabbi Zadok of Lublin says that the duty of the Jews is to pray exessively and then Meschiach would come. On the other hand, no one can really define the word "exessively". What is enough and how intense should the prayers be ?
The Gemara continues with the punishments for not keeping the oaths.
G - d said to the Jewish people: "If you abide by the oath, it will be well and good for you, but if not, I will permit your flesh to be hunted by the idolaters as the gazelles and as the hinds of the field".
In other words:
The Jews have to live in the Diaspora until G - d makes His decision and brings the Meschiach. If we live in Israel we influence His decision and might be punished by Him. Only our presents in the Holy Land could bring the Ge'ulah and thus we break the oath. Therefore, we deserve to be punished.
Despite the oaths, many Chassidim and Mitnagdim (litvish) did not see a problem by settling in Israel. They did not plan a State of Israel but wanted to set up religious settlements which were to be ruled according to the Torah law. Furthermore, prayers are more accepted in Israel than in the Galut.
But already the Baal Shem Tov emphazised the importance of living in Galut. Jews do have many tasks there and only by fulfilling them we can bring the Meschiach (also see Chassidut Rozhin and Rabbi Avraham Yehoshua Heshel of Apta). Those Chassidim who came to Israel 200 years ago, were simply fed up with suffering in one pogrom after the other in Eastern Europa. They finally wanted to live in peace.
At the end of the last century however, political Zionism became more and more popular and the Chassidim started to fight the new secular ideas. Israel can only exist according to Torah law and not by secular law. As a counterpart to national religious and secular Zionism they founded the Agudat Israel and the Edah HaCharedit. Today the Agudah has five seats in the Knesset and includes groups such as Vishnitz, Belz, Gur and litvishe Haredim. Although the members of the Agudat Israel are not necessarily too Zionist, they think that it is important to be in the Knesset and not only let the secular rule.
The Edah HaCharedit, on the other hand, refuses any cooperation or recognition of the State of Israel. The majority of their members refuse to accept financial help from the Israeli government and instead built up their own pension system, insurance and old age homes.
According to Chassidut Satmar the present State of Israel means breaking the oaths with G - d. Israel was built because the Jews are too impatient and all wars and problems we face in Israel today, are a punishment from G - d. Rebbe Teitelbaum as well as the founder of Chassidut Toldot Aharon, Rebbe Aharon Roth, even claim that the secular Zionists caused the Holocaust to happen.
These kind of claims should not be misinterpreted and are to be taken with caution. Nobody knows why there was a Holocaust and why G - d did what He did. We can only speculate about the reasons but as we are not G - d, we simply don't know. I always refuse to accept any human responses or reasons given for the Holocaust.
Many of you might ask why the Satmarer Chassidim do live in Israel at all.
Rebbe Teitelbaum was not against settling in Israel as long as his Chassidim do not get involved in any way with the secular State of Israel. They do not participate in elections, do not use public Egged - buses, etc. They rather have their own institutions and keep foreign passports. Not all of them but many.
The Edah HaCharedit basically refuses to accept the national religious parties and their kind of Zionism. In the eyes of the Edah, religious Zionists only help the secular to keep up their unholy State and cause the delay of Meschiach. There are hardly any relations between the Edah and the Agudah, as they are also seen as traitors. Just like the national religious.
Despite all contradictions I have to admit that I do see some points in the oaths in Masechet Ketubot.
Are we Israelis really too impatient and did we found a State which, according to the Gemara, should not yet exist ? There are many pros and cons. The Ramban, for instance, says that it is a Mitzwah to live in Israel. Many others and even the Talmud agree with him.
Everybody has to find her or his own way in order to be happy. If the Edah members do not agree with my point of view it doesn’t have to mean that we are enemies. Within the past years I got to know plenty of anti - Zionists and we always got along extremely well as long as we didn't speak about politics. But whatever reasons anti - Zionists mentioned hundreds of years ago, they do not really apply anymore today. What does it mean that G - d told the nations not to oppress the Jews too much ? Can we really say so after the Holocaust ?
Maybe also the anti - Zionist society has to change certain opinions because of the Holocaust. At least, Jews have their own country where we can live without being put into ghettos or exterminated. You are free to claim that also today we don't live in peace in Israel. This is absolutely true but who knows ?
The Ge'ulah is supposed to come in stages and not at once. Maybe the present secular State of Israel is such a stage and soon the Meschiach will come and bring us a Torah ruled State.
Sunday, December 2, 2007
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This was a great post!!! You explained everything quite well clearly and accurately! now if oonly u had the chabad responce to kesusbos 111
ReplyDeleteB"H
ReplyDeleteThis is not a problem. I could find out the Chabad opinion tonight.
As far as I know, Chabad is NOT in favour of a State of Israel as well, although many people think that they are Zionists.
The Chabadnikim I know don't celebrate the Israeli Independence Day.
B"H
ReplyDeleteI haven't forgotten about you.
Last night, I asked a Meshichist Chabad Rabbi about Chabad's opinion on Masechet Ketubot. He couldn't answer me right away and told me to come back later.:-)
I will find out the answer from someone who knows.
B"H
ReplyDeleteHERE COMES THE ANSWER FROM CHABAD ITSELF:
Question: Does the Rebbe recognize the State of Israel?
Rebbe: I write letters to Eretz Yisroel and also receive letters with their stamps. My followers in Eretz Yisroel help guard its borders, pay taxes, serve in the Israeli army, and spread Chassidus. Is that enough to be considered recognition?
Question: What I mean is, Can the State of Israel be considered the "Haschalat Ha'geula," start of the Redemption?
Rebbe: No. It can definitely not be considered the start of Redemption. The Redemption must always come together with Torah and Mitzvos. In the holiday Musaph prayer, we say "Mipnay Chato'aynu Golinu May'artzainu" -- because of our sins we were driven form our homeland - hence, the term Redemption signifies a diminishment of sins -- the more Redemption, the less sins.
Unfortunately, in the Eretz Yisroel of today, we are not witnessing a lessening of sins. On the contrary, there are many Jews who before 1947 were Torah-observant Jews, and after 1947, to our great sorrow, became non-observers. As regards these Jews, it can only be said that they went from one exile to a second one. Also to our great sorrow, we cannot say that in Eretz Yisroel there is an upgrade in compliance with Torah and Mitzvos; rather there is a definite decline. The State of Israel cannot therefore be referred to as the start of Redemption.
Source: http://www.chabad.org/392193
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From another interview, also with students, in 1963:
Student: Do you think the government in Israel is religious enough to be constitutional for religious Jews?
Rebbe: Are you asking whether the government is religious or not?
Student: I mean to ask whether all religious Jews should emigrate there.
Rebbe: We are now only a few days before the holiday of Shovuoth, the festival of the receiving of the Torah. As a preface to the giving of the Torah, G-d Almighty outlined what He expected of the Jewish people, and one point and highlight which is expected of the Jewish people, is that they should be a "Kingdom of Priests." If we find a proper government for a Kingdom of Priests, including every Jew and Jewess, then this government is fit to become the government of every Jew. The main purpose is to fulfill the Torah's institutions, to make the Jews become a Kingdom of Priests. This is not my own opinion -- it is what the Bible says.
Student: Since the establishment of the State of Israel, the American Jew is confronted with the problem of dual allegiance. Which should have priority?
Rebbe: I don't find a contradiction between them. The main thing is spiritual values, then come the secondary ones -- the army, guarding the borders, and all other things.
One's main purpose must be to become a Holy People and a Kingdom of Priests. Do not be afraid: you can become part of a Kingdom of Priests even if you are a professional or a businessman, an engineer or doctor...
(Source: http://www.chabad.org/354697)
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Fin ally,
here is a transcript of an interview with an elder chassid many years ago, Rabbi Yehuda Leib Posner:
No. Incidentally I can tell you something; there’s a little political thing, that the Ramash explained to my father about whether there should be a Medinas Yisrael or not; this happened before there was the Medina. And my father came from Pittsburgh because he had to meet with the Rashag about certain Yeshiva Inyanim so-at that point my brother Zalman and I didn’t eat Shabbos by any Baal Habbatim, there were certain Bachurim we ate in the Yeshiva, we made our own Shabbos, you know, whatever we prepared and that was it, so understandably our father wanted to spend Shabbos with us, not with, he could have eaten by Zeyer Sheyne Baal Habbatim…
So Friday night after Davening everybody went home, you know, and the Ramash asked my father to sit down. So he sat down on a bench there in the Zal and my brother Zalman and I were standing there listening and he was asking my father what’s doing in Pittsburgh, various different things, this that and the other. Then my father had a question for him. The question was: yea Medina or not Medina- then there was going on there was the Shalosh Shavous, Lo Yaalo B’Chaima and so on and there in Pittsburgh they had a very strong Mizrachi, Poel HaMizrachi; the question was what kind of a stand should he take.
So I remember he explained and later on, years later I asked my father if I remember correctly and he said yes I remember correctly, he explained it like this. This has nothing to do with Lo Yaalu B’Chaima, nothing to do with the Shalosh Shavous, nothing, it’s a simple question: There is a Medina in the world Vu M’Harget Yidden. Oib M’Vet Machen Ah Yiddishe Memshala Vet Men Yidden Nisht Hargenen-Iz Faran Ah Shaila In Dem? At that time anytime the Arabs would attack the Jews they would start to fight back so the British soldiers would come, you know, you read about that they would come and take away the guns from the Yidden and then they were stuck without anything, they would shoot them.
The Rebbe said like this: The Gemara says like this that before Moshiach comes Lo Yaalu B’Chaima, the jews are not permiteed to go up with strength, to go up with power to Eretz Yisrael, to take it with power. And there is the Shalosh Shavous-the three vows that we gave that we will not do certain things with Eretz Yisrael; that was the argument against having a Medinas Yisrael, having a Jewish Medina. So the Rebbe said this has no connection with that at all, it’s a simple question. There is a certain country in the world where Jews are being killed and if there will be a Jewish government Jews will not be killed, so is there a question over here? Of course you should make a Jewish government; this has nothing whatsoever to do with the Ischalta D’Geula-the beginning of the Geula, it has no connection with it whatsoever.
So over here in this particular case, over here there is situation as it was at time as I remember it from the papers and so on is that anytime the Arabs would come out and attack the Jews and the Jews would fight back so the British soldiers would come and they would disarm the Jews and let the Arabs go on fighting and shooting and they would get killed, they couldn’t protect themselves. If there would be a Jewish government obviously they would be able to protect themselves.
And the Rebbe continued to say, he explained that this has nothing to do with Ischalta D’Geula, it has no connection with the beginning of the Geula. And we Takeh see later on in later years how the Rebbe said Dos Iz Ah Chosech Kaful U’Mchupal-that it’s such a darkness which never was before so it has nothing to do with Geula, it’s just a way to protect Jews from getting killed, that’s all.
Did he say if that was the Frierdiker Rebbe’s opinion too?
No.
And you were there when the Rebbe explained this?
Yea, I was there when the Rebbe explained it.
How old were you at the time?
How old I was, probably around eighteen, nineteen. See I remember it very well also because at that time it was one of the subjects on the…and then later on I was able to comprehend also the Rebbe’s approach to this whole Inyan of Medinas Yisrael. When there was something to criticize he criticized, he didn’t hold himself back. When it came to support he supported; but the truth is the truth. When you have to criticize you criticize, he didn’t cover over anything, like he himself also said later on that it’s a Chosech Kaful U’Mchupal-that this is a darkness that never was before; Ay, there’s a Medina, that has nothing to do with it.
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